Sophia
newbie
Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 6
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Can anyone tell me if Allen has any city ordinances on bee-bee & pellet guns? A very young boy in my neighborhood (very young-meaning around 8 y/o) has what I think is a bee-bee gun that he shoots frequently in his back yard. What used to be a small gathering of friends his own age has evolved into a rather rambunctious group of Middle School boys gathering around to take a turn with this gun.
Our neighborhood has many very small children, not to mention pets and I have become very worried about their safety during these rather loud, obnoxious shooting parties, sometimes until 10:00pm on a school night.
I'm not sure if "Mom" knows about these gatherings or even cares seeing as how she obviously bought this gun for her son. Any ideas or suggestions on how to address this potentially dangerous situation? Many of the surrounding neighbors of this family have found plastic bee-bees or pellets in their back yards so obviously there's some richocheting (sp?) going on. What other recourse does a resident have if complaints fall on an uncaring parents deaf ears? Also, is there a curfew for kids in Allen? If so, for what ages and what time? Thanks guys.
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denisew
enthusiast
Reged: 02/18/02
Posts: 3234
Loc: Allen, TX
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I don't know the exact ordinance, but it is against the law for a citizen (of any age) to discharge any kind of firearm within the city limits. This seems to be a situation where the police should be involved. And, why do parents allow an 8 year old to handle a BB gun without proper supervision? I would definitely call the police and let them handle it. That way you and your neighbors don't have to burden themselves with confronting the parents.
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BCingU
member
Reged: 08/19/02
Posts: 58
Loc: allen, texas
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Yes, there is an ordinance. BBs include those little plastic or rubber pellets. Though most guns shooting the small stuff are spring-loaded, they are still considered to be firearms.
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Maurice
enthusiast
Reged: 12/03/01
Posts: 810
Loc: Allen, TX
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Sounds like airsoft guns to me, plastic BB's are for those type of guns. Plastic BB's are considered firearms? I take it paintball guns are as well then?
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Stogiez
enthusiast
Reged: 04/10/02
Posts: 267
Loc: Allen, TX, USA
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Straight from www.cityofallen.org cityhall code of ordinances on municode.com
Sec. 10-1. Firearms.
(a) It shall be unlawful for any person to fire or shoot or cause to be fired or shot any firearm, rifle, shotgun, automatic rifle, revolver, pistol or any other weapon designated for the purpose of firing or discharging a shell or cartridge, whether such shell or cartridge is blank or live ammunition, or to fire, shoot, discharge or cause to be fired, shot or discharged any air rifle, air pistol or pellet gun of any description, by whatever name known, that is capable of discharging a pellet or any solid object by means of compressed air, gas, springs or other means, within the corporate limits of the city.
(b) This section shall not apply:
(1) To police officers while in the performance of their official duties.
(2) Where a special permit has been obtained from the city. To secure such special permit, application must be made in writing to the chief of police, describing in detail the request of the applicant. Upon receipt of such request, the chief of police shall investigate said application. If the application is approved by the chief of police, he shall forthwith send to the applicant a letter setting forth the requirements or restrictions under which the permit will be granted. Should said application be disapproved, the chief of police shall also notify the applicant by letter. The applicant may appeal such ruling of the chief of police to the city council within two (2) weeks from the date of receipt of such notice.
(c) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or prohibited weapon listed in V.T.C.A., Penal Code � 46.05(a) on the premises of the municipal court or any offices utilized by the court. This provision does notapply to a certified peace officer in the course of his duty.
(Ord. No. 321, �� 1--3, 11-20-1980; Ord. No. 1388-1-96, � 1, 1-4-1996; Ord. No. 2198-8-03, � 1, 8-26-2003)
Cross references: Police, � 2-16 et seq.
State law references: Power of cities to prohibit the discharge of firearms, V.T.C.A., Penal Code � 42.12(d).
Guess I'm going to have to find another way to control the rabbits in my backyard. Maybe I'll use my blowgun. The darts are not cartridges nor shells. Or maybe a slingshot.
Hey Maurice, it looks like airsofts are on the "banned weapons" list. According to the letter of the law, any toy weapon that can discharge foam discs are also on the banned list.
All kidding aside--those kids should not be playing with a BB gun, or any other type of weapon as in the situation described in Sophia's first post.
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Maurice
enthusiast
Reged: 12/03/01
Posts: 810
Loc: Allen, TX
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So if someone breaks into my house and I shoot him, I'll get hit with a fine for shooting within city limits I suppose? lol
Yes, the kids should be as safe as possible with shooting their airsoft guns. This is the responsibility of the parents, if you are going to allow your child to have a gun of ANY kind, you should teach them proper safety and firearm etiquette. Sounds like his parents aren't paying much attention to what he's doing with his new toy.
That's a bit much having even those foam disc guns covered by this list, glad I haven't shot off my paintball gun in my backyard in a long time. I've taken it out for a quick test fire just to make sure everything was in order the day before I would go out to play, didn't shoot up the fence or anything like that. lol
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outkast
member
Reged: 06/28/05
Posts: 56
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I want to go on record to say the COA sux and so does anyone that backs thse kind of crap laws.
Now let me explain. Shooting a gun in the city, 357/22/ak-47, i can understand, but BB gun? Pellet gun? Airsoft gun?! Give me a break! Man I remember growing up south of here and thats all we did when it was nice out. Grabbed our guns and hit the woods. Squirrels, rabbits, whatever didnt stand a chance. Those were the days. Now you cant step off the curb without racking up fines. Kid spend all day comatose in front of tv's. Thats why their all fat!
They will have to Pry my daisy red rider from my cold dead hands!
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Mvpo
enthusiast
Reged: 06/21/02
Posts: 169
Loc: Allen, TX, USA
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You have obviously never seen a kid who has lost an eye due to being shot by a BB gun. I have and it was a sensless result that affected him the rest of his life.
M
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Stogiez
enthusiast
Reged: 04/10/02
Posts: 267
Loc: Allen, TX, USA
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Times have changed. haha
Here's some good news:
State of Texas - HUNTING INSIDE CITY LIMITS
Agriculture Code Section 251.002,and 251.005, Local Government Code, Section 229.002
Allows hunting in areas annexed by a city
A rifle or pistol may be used on 50 acres or more if discharged more than 300 feet from a residence. A shotgun, air rifle, or bow may be used on 10 acres if more than 150 feet from a residence. (SB 734 passed in 2005, but is not yet posted in statutes on Texas Legislature On Line. It is on that site in bill form.) haha
 
BTW, this was discussed in another thread--
http://www.allenonline.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=31317&an=0&page=1#Post31317
http://www.allenonline.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=31848&an=0&page=12#Post31848
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Pirate
enthusiast
Reged: 06/20/03
Posts: 209
Loc: Allen, TX
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Quote:
I want to go on record to say the COA sux and so does anyone that backs thse kind of crap laws. ...
Grow up. Making childish comments like this shows nothing you say can be taken seriously.
Edited by Pirate (01/30/07 05:25 PM)
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EmBee
enthusiast
Reged: 02/22/05
Posts: 115
Loc: Allen
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My husband was shot by a pellet gun when he and a bunch of friends were camping in the woods where the baseball park is now. It was a complete accident, but he lost total sight in that eye. It was a metal pellet
He was 18 then and 20 years later, he's still dealing with some pain.
I think 8 years old is way too young if they aren't properly supervised. You have very viable concerns so I'd would call the police fast.
I had a youngster (5th grade) show up at my house with his pellet gun last year, I told him to take it home and not bring it back. I don't think he'd ever had rules about it before since he rolled his eyes, said something and never came back!
The lack of B.B/pellet guns in a childs life is not the cause of fat children. We have fat kids because of convenient fast food and parents that won't turn off the TV.
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God gave you a gift of 86,400 seconds today. Have you used one to say "Thank You?
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outkast
member
Reged: 06/28/05
Posts: 56
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Yes. I agree! Lets outlaw all BB guns because there are those people out there that have no sense and are dumb enough to shoot themselves or their "buddies" in the eye! Makes perfect sense. While were at it can we ban cars because 43,000 people a year die in car crashes or how about cigarettes for the 440,000 smokers and 35,000 second hand smoke deaths a year? Please? Give me a break! Lets dumb everything down for the idiots can we??
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Stogiez
enthusiast
Reged: 04/10/02
Posts: 267
Loc: Allen, TX, USA
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Or you can just realize that it really doesn't affect your everyday life, unless your plinking in your backyard everyday.
Also, if the use is to take out an occasional ferocious rabbit who is charging at you you probably won't get hauled off to the pokey. More than likely, you wouldn't even be heard.
But--if the user is being destructive with the BB gun, not only could APD get the user for destruction of property, but ALSO the discharging of said BB gun.
It gives the authorities the additional weight IF the situation calls for it.
Please understand I am not a LEO for the CoA or any other city.
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allenmom
enthusiast
Reged: 07/02/03
Posts: 117
Loc: allen
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My neighbors are always shooting something that shoots tiny green plastic balls. I've been in the backyard while they were doing it and got hit in the arm. It stung! I have small children and I don't let them play outside when the neighbors have the gun out. I know it's just plastic, but it could hit a child in the eye. I think they should go someplace unpopulated to shoot them. My backyard is full of the little green things. I could go gather up at least 100 of them right now! I think they shoot at the birds in my trees. The parents won't let them shoot it in their own backyard because of the swimming pool!
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civicminded
enthusiast
Reged: 04/24/02
Posts: 4406
Loc: Lone Star State
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Therein lies the result of unsupervised, and uneducated shooters. I'm one that owns and enjoys such devices. But pellet/BB weapons will cause damage and injury, anytime they contact something not designed as a target.
Being a Scouter, I see questions about wishing the BSA would allow paintball games. Paintball isn't allowed in their programs, as it usually involves targeting other persons. That doesn't fit into their objectives (and it hurts). BB's, rifle and shotgun shooting is allowed, as they're used in proper ways to learn safety and develop skill. Law Enforcement Exploring also permits handgun activities, as the same parameters are in place.
Locally, my family was targeted by a local yahoo and his buddies, with their shotguns.This was on the property where east Kroger now resides. This "gentleman" was firing in the air (thank goodness!), in a manner to lay a pattern on my family and car (while we worked a garden down there). The rest isn't important here.
Suffice it to say, regardless of any Ordinance in place or not, in any locale...adults must participate in any such activity. Adults that choose to allow these tools, must realize there is great responsibility and accountability involved. Know where your child is...and know where the guns are. Toy guns are toys. Others are not. 
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Maurice
enthusiast
Reged: 12/03/01
Posts: 810
Loc: Allen, TX
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How'd things turn out with the idiot with the shotgun? It's people like that who tick me off, they misuse firearms and people end up injured or worse so the firearms get the bad rep. I've yet to see a single firearm wound or kill a person on its own, it takes a person to use the tool (firearm) to do the damage.
Hope that issue is all over and done with and the outcome was positive.
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civicminded
enthusiast
Reged: 04/24/02
Posts: 4406
Loc: Lone Star State
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It turned out OK, as neither he or I wound up wounded. But he and the buds were hunting at a later date, and talked of shooting the Deputy they saw nearby. So, like an email going around lately "they walk among us".
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EmBee
enthusiast
Reged: 02/22/05
Posts: 115
Loc: Allen
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Quote:
Yes. I agree! Lets outlaw all BB guns because there are those people out there that have no sense and are dumb enough to shoot themselves or their "buddies" in the eye! Makes perfect sense. While were at it can we ban cars because 43,000 people a year die in car crashes or how about cigarettes for the 440,000 smokers and 35,000 second hand smoke deaths a year? Please? Give me a break! Lets dumb everything down for the idiots can we??
Wow, you're a little too sarcastic for my liking! However, I'd like to reply to that.
My husband is not an idiot and the other boy was just 11.
The boy that shot him was several years younger and shooting at leaves in the direction of my husbands crowd in city limits. He was unsupervised and going on what he claimed, it was his first gun and he only had it for a short time.
That kid's grown now and probably none the worse for wear, whereas my husband is still blind in his left eye and will have more troubles as he ages.
I don't have issues with kids having them, I have issues with young unsupervised kids shooting them in the city limits. There's no need for it and it invites trouble...even if it is an accident.
Any parent that gives their child something like that should be willing to spend the time to supervise them.
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God gave you a gift of 86,400 seconds today. Have you used one to say "Thank You?
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outkast
member
Reged: 06/28/05
Posts: 56
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Bee - whether you like it not is irrelevant, the point is the same. It isnt the guns that are bad, its the operators. You dont outlaw the guns (shouldnt) youshould teach people to use them. Parents once again letting their kids down. Although ive hunted with adults that are worse than my kid. Much like Pit Bulls arent bad dogs, they just have bad owners sometimes. (that oughta get 'em going tehehe)
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EmBee
enthusiast
Reged: 02/22/05
Posts: 115
Loc: Allen
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What I don't like was your sarcasm and you mentioning "outlaw" twice now in reply to things I've said. Will you kindly point out where I've said that they need to be outlawed? Read again, a little slower this time, because what I have said is that young children should be supervised and that they don't need to be within city limits.
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