Owl
newbie
Posts: 15
Reg: 09-02-11
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09-03-11 01:17 AM - Post#138151
What would kind of budget do the various sports teams have? What about the band budget. Would reducing some of these activities save teachers?
I am not downplaying the importance of sports or band. I just want to save the academic teachers first.
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sco
enthusiast
Posts: 2667
Loc: allen,TX USA
Reg: 10-26-02
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09-03-11 09:42 AM - Post#138160
In response to Owl
There has been significant discussion on this particular issue in the past if you look through the archives. The district is looking at the cuts that can be made without drastically affecting programs. Remember that band and athletics are credit elective classes so if the students weren't in those they would have to be somewhere else
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GrammyOf9
newbie
Posts: 9
Reg: 08-28-11
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09-10-11 11:50 AM - Post#138651
In response to sco
Remember that band and athletics are credit elective classes so if the students weren't in those they would have to be somewhere else
That is definitely true. I don't know how the scheduling works at the high school, but I can imagine that with a 750+ member band, they can't all have band at the same time. So just making a guess and for the sake of establishing a scenario, let's say they're divided into 3 sections of 250. For EACH section of 250, that places 5 classes of 50 students (or 10 classes of 25). So significantly reducing the band program (or athletics, etc.) would create a need for different classes to be offered for all these students at that class time - meaning more teachers and thus money to hire them.
Too, let's not forget that Allen High's Escadrille and numerous athletics programs are nationally recognized as high caliber programs, which not only benefits our students through recruiting & scholarships but also our community through the increasing number of businesses opening or corporations relocating headquarters to Allen.
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AllenResident01
newbie
Posts: 17
Reg: 08-10-11
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09-10-11 03:05 PM - Post#138661
In response to GrammyOf9
Actually, all of the band members do meet together early in the morning for their class/practice. While the band’s size does get some notoriety, I highly doubt that it has an impact on where corporations locate their headquarters. Last night is a perfect example of how cuts can be made. Does the entire band really need to travel to away games, especially a game in Longview? Since they had to use charter buses, I’m sure there was a pretty penny spent on hiring 25 or so charter busses and drivers for evening. Let’s see that money spent on teachers’ salaries instead.
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Brewer
enthusiast
Posts: 1285
Reg: 06-02-07
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09-10-11 05:16 PM - Post#138668
In response to AllenResident01
Good idea. Send a bus full per week!
A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week.
-GEN George S. Patton
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chf
enthusiast
Posts: 492
Loc: NW Allen
Reg: 12-22-07
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09-10-11 07:27 PM - Post#138671
In response to AllenResident01
What a terrific idea. Why don't we just send half of the football team as well. Friday night games are just as much about marching band as it is the football team. The band isn't there just to support the team. They are there to perform the show they have been working on just has hard as for just as many hours as the football team.
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AllenResident01
newbie
Posts: 17
Reg: 08-10-11
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09-10-11 09:25 PM - Post#138673
In response to chf
Glad you agree and an interesting idea about the football team since half of the team never steps foot on the field during the game anyway. Nice touch.
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eddie
newbie
Posts: 24
Reg: 08-30-11
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09-10-11 09:56 PM - Post#138677
In response to AllenResident01
Without being too impolite, allenresident01, why don't you go to the band boosters and athletics boosters and tell them exactly why their children should not be able to participate in these activities.
I am sure they would be receptive.
Again, with all due respect, do you have any idea of how many volunteers spend their time and effort for these programs?
Regardless, even if the TRE does pass. your dreams will come true. The district still will have to drastically reduce expenditures.
In the current situation, with or without the TRE, the Escadrille and the football team and the choir and the track team and the golf team and every kindergartner and every teacher and every thing in the district will be affected. That is a fact.
Either way, up or down, you win.
There is a secret, though, if the TRE passes, you will still be paying less taxes than you did in 2005. You may look it up, if you wish.
A lot of people in this community have worked a long time to make Allen special. They worked to make it a good place to live and raise children. That work has paid off. Just look around.
If we had a lousy, corrupt school district, none of the things we enjoy would have happened.
I moved here about fifteen years ago beause it was a nice place to live and because the school district had a strong commitment to education and its students.
I have not seen anything to dissuade me at this point.
Apparently, you have.
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AllenConsumer
member
Posts: 75
Reg: 07-06-11
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09-11-11 12:46 AM - Post#138687
In response to eddie
Finally we're having a real discussion with real ideas.
Why not come up with a travel squad for the football team (less players). Even the colleges do that. So why not go with a smaller (core) set of band personnel on away games? What's wrong with bringing up ideas? Let's put all on the table.
Guys, the kids won't suffer and the sky isn't falling if you vote no on TRE. Allen ISD will make due. They always have.
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Gary
enthusiast
Posts: 369
Reg: 06-25-01
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09-11-11 01:24 AM - Post#138688
In response to AllenConsumer
AISD Elementary classrooms with more than 22 students:
2010-2011: Zero
2011-2012: 65 or 1495+ students
AISD Secondary classrooms with more than 30 students:
Middle School: 71 or 2201+ students
High School/LFC: 99 or 3069+ students
Total number of students impacted by larger classroom sizes: 6765+ students
As you can see, the students are already feeling the impact of budget reductions. AISD has cut over $4.5 million from the current budget.
What isn't mentioned is that most of the classrooms in the middle schools and high schools are not large enough to accommodate 30+ students at one time. Sure they can sit on the floor and listen or double-up at a desk, but the learning environment suffers.
Reducing the number of students traveling to away games will save a little money, but not to the magnitude necessary to protect the learning environment in the classroom.
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AllenResident01
newbie
Posts: 17
Reg: 08-10-11
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09-11-11 08:35 AM - Post#138694
In response to eddie
Don’t try to paint me with that brush. I don’t consider cutting student programs a win. I don’t have dreams of eliminating positions and salaries in the district. I love living in Allen. I have three kids in the Allen ISD and I believe that my kids are getting a quality education in Allen. I have the upmost respect for their teachers and the volunteers that make it happen. However, it sickens me to hear that the only resolution is cutting teachers and how much larger the class sizes will be. I understand that it’s a scare tactic to get voters off their butts and vote for the TRE.
What’s wrong with a few ideas on how the budget can be cut before they get to teachers? The band already has “shadows”; kids that challenge other kids for the right to participate in game presentations. Simply increase the number of shadows. I would expect that the kids might even work harder and practice more on their own if they know that they had to beat someone out for the right to travel to away games.
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sco
enthusiast
Posts: 2667
Loc: allen,TX USA
Reg: 10-26-02
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09-11-11 10:03 AM - Post#138698
In response to AllenResident01
There is nothing wrong with presenting cost saving ideas. The band has already implemented some cost saving ideas such as walking to home games. The problem comes when people think ideas like these solve the problem. There was a story on the news the other night about a district that had decided to make the move and have all of the bands not go to away games. The total cost saving was on the order of saving one teacher's salary. That's not a bad thing but it is a drop in the bucket to the overall problem. Another example, people think we can just cut some administrators. To solve the problem with only administrator cuts would leave us without any administrators. The numbers just don't work. It's not that the district wants to cut teachers. It's that the teachers are the bulk of the budget and you just can't get to the numbers required without affecting teachers.
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optimist
member
Posts: 61
Reg: 08-13-11
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09-11-11 11:26 AM - Post#138708
In response to AllenConsumer
Finally we're having a real discussion with real ideas.
Why not come up with a travel squad for the football team (less players). Even the colleges do that. So why not go with a smaller (core) set of band personnel on away games? What's wrong with bringing up ideas? Let's put all on the table.
Guys, the kids won't suffer and the sky isn't falling if you vote no on TRE. Allen ISD will make due. They always have.
These types of comments or suggestions should spark quite a few 'yes' votes from band and football parents.
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sco
enthusiast
Posts: 2667
Loc: allen,TX USA
Reg: 10-26-02
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09-12-11 07:40 AM - Post#138750
In response to AllenConsumer
Guys, the kids won't suffer and the sky isn't falling if you vote no on TRE. Allen ISD will make due. They always have.
The district will "make do" as you say and the schools will be open but the kids will suffer. Classes of 35 or 40 kids is not a good learning environment. Look at California schools. Twenty years ago they had an enviable system. They have now starved it to the point of being dismal. That is not what I want for Texas and certainly not for Allen.
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AllenConsumer
member
Posts: 75
Reg: 07-06-11
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09-12-11 01:43 PM - Post#138794
In response to Gary
AISD Elementary classrooms with more than 22 students:
2010-2011: Zero
2011-2012: 65 or 1495+ students
AISD Secondary classrooms with more than 30 students:
Middle School: 71 or 2201+ students
High School/LFC: 99 or 3069+ students
Total number of students impacted by larger classroom sizes: 6765+ students
As you can see, the students are already feeling the impact of budget reductions. AISD has cut over $4.5 million from the current budget.
What isn't mentioned is that most of the classrooms in the middle schools and high schools are not large enough to accommodate 30+ students at one time. Sure they can sit on the floor and listen or double-up at a desk, but the learning environment suffers.
Reducing the number of students traveling to away games will save a little money, but not to the magnitude necessary to protect the learning environment in the classroom.
See. This is the first I've heard of classroom overcrowding and apparently we're doing well.
Yes, cutting on travel squads, etc. won't save on the large scale but everyone should contribute. It's a mindset of 'cost-cutting'. Every program should contribute.
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chf
enthusiast
Posts: 492
Loc: NW Allen
Reg: 12-22-07
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09-12-11 02:58 PM - Post#138801
In response to AllenConsumer
See. This is the first I've heard of classroom overcrowding and apparently we're doing well.
So, you consider 235 overcrowded classrooms as "doing well?" I sure don't.
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gaylonlee
enthusiast
Posts: 154
Reg: 03-06-06
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09-13-11 12:09 AM - Post#138837
In response to AllenConsumer
See. This is the first I've heard of classroom overcrowding and apparently we're doing well.
Yes, cutting on travel squads, etc. won't save on the large scale but everyone should contribute. It's a mindset of 'cost-cutting'. Every program should contribute.
Just to get us started, what programs are your 3 kids in, and what proactive steps have you taken to offset the cost of their involvement for Allen ISD? Donated uniforms/instruments/supp lies? We could use a leader by example, not just another offering cuts for programs of others' kids. Thanks.
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PS59
newbie
Posts: 9
Reg: 11-23-09
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10-09-11 12:16 AM - Post#140476
In response to AllenResident01
Actually, all of the band members do meet together early in the morning for their class/practice. While the band’s size does get some notoriety, I highly doubt that it has an impact on where corporations locate their headquarters. Last night is a perfect example of how cuts can be made. Does the entire band really need to travel to away games, especially a game in Longview? Since they had to use charter buses, I’m sure there was a pretty penny spent on hiring 25 or so charter busses and drivers for evening. Let’s see that money spent on teachers’ salaries instead.
This is all about what WE want to do.
YES the entire band need to travel unless "WE" is just "SOME OF US"
WE vote for local elected officials including School Board officials. If WE want a different outcome, WE should vote for different officials.
Personally, I love the Band and Football team as these are ambassadors for the city in my opinion.
WE should all travel!
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