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Username Post: 1/20 board meeting        (Topic#22950)
Cheatham Parent 
enthusiast
Posts: 225

Reg: 01-23-11

01-22-14 01:05 PM - Post#165736    

Looked to me like a lot of grandstanding going on this week during the school board meeting. Interesting watch.

http://allenisd.swagit.com/player.php?refid=012120...

 
MelissaM 
enthusiast
Posts: 215
MelissaM
Reg: 01-02-04

01-23-14 02:14 PM - Post#165777    
    In response to Cheatham Parent

Any section in particular? just skimmed but didn't go in too deep, since some sections are pretty long.

 
SB 
enthusiast
Posts: 1551

Reg: 09-07-03

01-23-14 05:16 PM - Post#165787    
    In response to MelissaM

I didn't perceive anything as grandstanding. I saw some strong questions about budget items but thought they were good questions that needed a clear answer.

 
MikeC 
enthusiast
Posts: 120

Reg: 07-21-02

01-24-14 02:38 AM - Post#165796    
    In response to SB

I viewed only a portion of the budget discussion before I couldn't take it anymore. The discussion was so off track they couldn't find the rails.

It's clear to see who actually read the information before the meeting and who just talks to hear themselves speak. The pandering of other board members claiming they are for teachers and staff when it's clear, based on their prior actions, they don't care about teachers.

I'll watch the remaining of the recorded meeting, but I'm praying this group can keep focused and hire a good superintendent. But I can't imagine who with a sound mind and stellar career would willingly come to work for these seven. I'm not saying all seven are bad, but there are three that clearly don't understand the role of a school board.

 
vrs 
enthusiast
Posts: 2845
vrs
Loc: Allen, Texas
Reg: 04-20-00

02-09-14 05:44 PM - Post#166089    
    In response to MikeC

I watched the whole thing. There's an hour and 10 minutes of my life I will never get back. I need to stop watching these - bad for my blood pressure. I also went back and re-viewed the September 2012 regular meeting - agenda items 4b and 4c. Now I am really mad.

<Long post alert>
As an aside, there is a selection process that completely escapes me with regard to which topics certain members choose to pick apart in incredible detail and which ones are skimmed past.

I have a few thoughts after to listening to this whole thing, but there are a couple of "can't miss" moments on the highlights reel:

40 minutes in, Jason and a couple of the other trustees are surprised to discover there is only one employee in the finance department since Mark Tarpley left and the CFO position was left vacant to be filled by the new sup. I am a civilian and I knew that. I knew it last summer. When it was stated in a board workshop. Anyway, the entire exchange is kind of humorous in a very sad way.

49 minutes in, Mike Myers plaintively asks "Do we have something we can vote on?" which I took to mean "Can we please wrap this up and move on?" I agreed with the sentiment.

Okay, Texas school finance is pretty complicated but the basic principles are simple. The legislature allows the district so many dollars of revenue per student per penny of tax effort. If your local property valuations and tax effort bring in less than that, the legislature makes up the difference. If it brings in more than that, you send money back to the state.

So here (in simplest terms) are the big variables for revenue - property wealth divided by enrollment, pennies of tax effort, legislated target revenue per student. Then you need to know that 85-ish percent of the budget is payroll, so headcount and payscale drive the expense side.

Legislated target revenue per student is interesting because that is the number that can vary substantially from one session to the next. Thanks heavens they only meet in alternate years. Hard to predict so the best one can do is keep a healthy fund balance in case the legislature does something draconian (as it did in 2011) and - here are the magic words for managing a school budget - keep staffing levels commensurate with enrollment.

A healthy fund balance is necessary for a lot of reasons but here are three big ones:
1) Smooth the legislative bumps. If your funding gets cut dramatically - as it did in 2011 - it creates maneuvering room to realign and balance the budget.
2) Keep your bond rating high. Now that the permanent school fund is fully subscribed in terms of backing bond debt, districts have to go borrow money on the strength of their own ratings. Undesignated fund balance is a major factor in the bond rating formula.
3) Bridge the annual gap between start of school and the flow of property tax revenue in property wealthy districts. If a district is receiving money from the state, the state will front load the payments so the district can operate until its local revenue begins to flow in November - Jan timeframe. Property wealthy districts have to pay from fund balance or else be faced with taking out short term loans to make payroll.

So, we hold as axiomatic that a healthy fund balance is a good thing. But "healthy" has to be defined. Anything beyond that and the district needs to release revenue back to local taxpayers. And healthy IS defined - in state guidelines and local policy.

Back in May of 2000, the Allen ISD had less than one million dollars in fund balance and was facing a 4.5 million dollar budget shortfall for the 2000-2001 school year. The district got through that crisis, but teachers and students paid the price. By the fall of 2001, there were more than 80 sections of core subject classes at the HS with more than 30 students. Think about MS science teachers doing desktop demonstrations instead of kids being able to work at lab stations because there weren't enough to go around. Picture HS math and English teachers seeing 150-180 students every two days.

Over the next 9 years, the district consistently underspent revenue, opened a new facility every year, lowered class sizes, and built up a significant fund balance. Again, it was staff doing more with less. And in the decade from 2000-2010, while the district nearly doubled in size, the central office staff professional headcount remained unchanged.

There were a few bumps in the road along the way and the district took some money from fund balance to cover teacher pay increases a couple of times during that period to smooth over those bumps.

In 2011, the legislature finally threw a giant redwood across the road and the district could not get over it without the TRE. So they put it on the ballot. In June of 2011, a conservative political think tank out of Austin went into the Keller ISD and actively funded and engaged a big "vote no" campaign to defeat their TRE. This is the same group that was active this past spring in places like Lovejoy ISD - helping to defeat their bonds.

So I went to Ken Helvey and asked if a PAC had been formed to help pass the TRE and he said no one had really stepped up and he was frankly worried. The district can distribute information but it cannot use taxpayer dollars to campaign.

I got together with a retired assistant superintendent and organized a campaign. Louise, Lois, Gary, and Susan worked like Trojans on that campaign. Jason and Mark may have sent out some emails, but I never saw a contribution or any visible presence or public advocacy from them to get the TRE passed. I am not saying they did nothing - they voted to put it on the ballot - but I am saying they did so little that they never made it onto the radar of the chairperson or treasurer or volunteer coordinator of the PAC as being a force in that election. Myers of course was not on the Board at the time and he did not bother to vote in the TRE. I thank again each and every person who voted yes.

But you understand how I feel a bit personally on the line about the TRE. During the campaign, the biggest reservation I heard, even from supporters, was "If we approve this now and they don't need it in the future, will they roll it back?" At the time I thought surely so, but now I think not - or not without pressure.

Fast forward to September 2012. One year after the TRE, the new positions have been hired, the final property valuations are in, and administration is recommending a one time payment to the staff. Basically it is the balance of a 3% midpoint increase but paid as a lump sum rather than an add to base. So they know they can afford it and there is no future commitment.

The Board splits 4-3 in favor of the payment. Louise said it best - "We told staff and taxpayers this is why we needed the money. We have to keep our word." Jason and Mark were worried about fund balance and what the legislature might or might not do in 2013. Again, the recommendation was an affordable one time payment - not an add to base that would commit future revenues. Carl also voted against it. I could give him a new guy pass on that one but Jason and Mark should have known better.

Now it is summer of 2013 and the Board has been conservative in staff compensation in the spring because the legislature was in session and heaven only knows what they will do. As it happens, the legislature smiles and AISD receives more than anticipated. I think six million more is the number but not sure on that - let's say "several million." They have the opportunity to roll back a little of the M&O tax rate but they don't. I mean come on - at least take a page from the City of Allen book and lower it by 1/100th of a penny or something. Some good faith gesture even.

The deal is, once the district reduces the tax rate, they can't go back up again without holding another TRE. So they are afraid of their own voters. Instead, Jason suggests (and Mark supports) we lower the tax rate by gutting the general fund balance to pay for capital projects instead of selling authorized bonds. The First Southwest guys and Marlene have to go back and explain how bad it would be for the district to do that.

This is just 9 short months after they refused to spend 1 million out of fund balance to compensate staff!

Then, in October, Mark gets the idea to designate 2.5 million dollars out of the surplus for an add to base teacher raise. The Board never talked about the longer term implications of that add to base move. I even asked a couple of them if I missed it. Nope. Everybody votes for it (including Jason.)

It was most likely the right thing to do, but it was done in a vacuum of the right kind of information and inquiry. What I would have loved to have seen as a taxpayer (and would have asked for as a trustee last summer) is a cash flow projection for the next several years given best demographic projections, conservative property value increases, annual staff compensation increase, and do no harm from the legislature. What does that look like and what can we afford?

Instead here they are in January asking about spending $38K from an activity fund to resurface the tennis courts and extra bottled water for the kids during playoffs.

On the January 20 meeting that is the subject line of this post, Mark says that he will consider lowering the tax rate "if and only if the TRE rules change." Meaning if and only if they can reduce the rate now and raise it back later without calling another TRE.

Doesn't anyone see how wasteful and destructive this cycle is? The legislature gets beaten up because local tax rates went through the roof in the wake of the 2011 session. So they put money back into the system in 2013. But the local districts don't lower the rates at all because they don't trust the legislature not to take it away in the future and they don't trust their own voters to understand that and vote yes in the future. The legislators say - hey, we gave money back but the local boards did not do their part.

Jason and Mark SAY the taxpayers are their constituents (they don't say the kids are their constituents - that's another issue) but they clearly don't trust their constituents to understand complex issues and vote responsibly.

I personally believe the AISD should have lowered the M&O rate last summer. But then, I have profound respect and no fear with regard to my friends and neighbors who vote in Allen.

The Board has another chance this next summer. They have already said they'll be on the ballot in 2015 with a bond proposition for Lowery refresh and other maintenance items. Perfect time to revisit the TRE if the funding shrinks in the 2015 session. Allen voters are smart and responsible. The Board needs to show some faith.

I just feel the honest and concerned and intelligent dialog about the educaton and future of our children has been hijacked the past several years by special interests and empty political rhetoric. I want to see discussions about HB-5 with its changes in basic 4x4 curriculum and the graduate profile and a top to bottom refocus on the strategic plan.

Bringing in a new superintendent creates an opportunity for positive change. I hope we take it. The kids are our most important constituents. Let's not lose sight of that.
Raisin cookies that look like chocolate chip are the reason I have trust issues.


 
Allensince1993 
enthusiast
Posts: 521

Reg: 06-06-12

02-09-14 06:01 PM - Post#166090    
    In response to vrs

I'm glad I'm not the only one who saw the train take a detour. We all focused on bus barns, etc. and I saw present members of the board getting lost well before then.

Thanks for your post. Still wish you were serving at the top.
James DeLaGarza
Realtor/Broker since 1992


 
DrivinTooFast 
enthusiast
Posts: 1874

Reg: 02-20-08

02-09-14 06:25 PM - Post#166091    
    In response to Allensince1993

Reducing the tax rate (even when no longer needed) to the ISD is like taking a binky away from a 2 year old - ain't gonna happen without a tantrum.

 
SB 
enthusiast
Posts: 1551

Reg: 09-07-03

02-10-14 03:31 PM - Post#166105    
    In response to DrivinTooFast

VM - long? You have a talent for distilling the details of a complicated situation to a concise, clear explanation. Thanks

 
Will 
enthusiast
Posts: 254

Reg: 07-28-09

02-11-14 01:17 PM - Post#166116    
    In response to SB

Thanks much. As a voter and a parent, I certainly appreciate the thought you put into your post.

 
Allensince1993 
enthusiast
Posts: 521

Reg: 06-06-12

02-17-14 02:55 PM - Post#166211    
    In response to vrs

  • vrs Said:
I watched the whole thing. There's an hour and 10 minutes of my life I will never get back. I need to stop watching these - bad for my blood pressure. I also went back and re-viewed the September 2012 regular meeting - agenda items 4b and 4c. Now I am really mad.

<Long post alert>
As an aside, there is a selection process that completely escapes me with regard to which topics certain members choose to pick apart in incredible detail and which ones are skimmed past.

I have a few thoughts after to listening to this whole thing, but there are a couple of "can't miss" moments on the highlights reel:

40 minutes in, Jason and a couple of the other trustees are surprised to discover there is only one employee in the finance department since Mark Tarpley left and the CFO position was left vacant to be filled by the new sup. I am a civilian and I knew that. I knew it last summer. When it was stated in a board workshop. Anyway, the entire exchange is kind of humorous in a very sad way.

49 minutes in, Mike Myers plaintively asks "Do we have something we can vote on?" which I took to mean "Can we please wrap this up and move on?" I agreed with the sentiment.

Okay, Texas school finance is pretty complicated but the basic principles are simple. The legislature allows the district so many dollars of revenue per student per penny of tax effort. If your local property valuations and tax effort bring in less than that, the legislature makes up the difference. If it brings in more than that, you send money back to the state.

So here (in simplest terms) are the big variables for revenue - property wealth divided by enrollment, pennies of tax effort, legislated target revenue per student. Then you need to know that 85-ish percent of the budget is payroll, so headcount and payscale drive the expense side.

Legislated target revenue per student is interesting because that is the number that can vary substantially from one session to the next. Thanks heavens they only meet in alternate years. Hard to predict so the best one can do is keep a healthy fund balance in case the legislature does something draconian (as it did in 2011) and - here are the magic words for managing a school budget - keep staffing levels commensurate with enrollment.

A healthy fund balance is necessary for a lot of reasons but here are three big ones:
1) Smooth the legislative bumps. If your funding gets cut dramatically - as it did in 2011 - it creates maneuvering room to realign and balance the budget.
2) Keep your bond rating high. Now that the permanent school fund is fully subscribed in terms of backing bond debt, districts have to go borrow money on the strength of their own ratings. Undesignated fund balance is a major factor in the bond rating formula.
3) Bridge the annual gap between start of school and the flow of property tax revenue in property wealthy districts. If a district is receiving money from the state, the state will front load the payments so the district can operate until its local revenue begins to flow in November - Jan timeframe. Property wealthy districts have to pay from fund balance or else be faced with taking out short term loans to make payroll.

So, we hold as axiomatic that a healthy fund balance is a good thing. But "healthy" has to be defined. Anything beyond that and the district needs to release revenue back to local taxpayers. And healthy IS defined - in state guidelines and local policy.

Back in May of 2000, the Allen ISD had less than one million dollars in fund balance and was facing a 4.5 million dollar budget shortfall for the 2000-2001 school year. The district got through that crisis, but teachers and students paid the price. By the fall of 2001, there were more than 80 sections of core subject classes at the HS with more than 30 students. Think about MS science teachers doing desktop demonstrations instead of kids being able to work at lab stations because there weren't enough to go around. Picture HS math and English teachers seeing 150-180 students every two days.

Over the next 9 years, the district consistently underspent revenue, opened a new facility every year, lowered class sizes, and built up a significant fund balance. Again, it was staff doing more with less. And in the decade from 2000-2010, while the district nearly doubled in size, the central office staff professional headcount remained unchanged.

There were a few bumps in the road along the way and the district took some money from fund balance to cover teacher pay increases a couple of times during that period to smooth over those bumps.

In 2011, the legislature finally threw a giant redwood across the road and the district could not get over it without the TRE. So they put it on the ballot. In June of 2011, a conservative political think tank out of Austin went into the Keller ISD and actively funded and engaged a big "vote no" campaign to defeat their TRE. This is the same group that was active this past spring in places like Lovejoy ISD - helping to defeat their bonds.

So I went to Ken Helvey and asked if a PAC had been formed to help pass the TRE and he said no one had really stepped up and he was frankly worried. The district can distribute information but it cannot use taxpayer dollars to campaign.

I got together with a retired assistant superintendent and organized a campaign. Louise, Lois, Gary, and Susan worked like Trojans on that campaign. Jason and Mark may have sent out some emails, but I never saw a contribution or any visible presence or public advocacy from them to get the TRE passed. I am not saying they did nothing - they voted to put it on the ballot - but I am saying they did so little that they never made it onto the radar of the chairperson or treasurer or volunteer coordinator of the PAC as being a force in that election. Myers of course was not on the Board at the time and he did not bother to vote in the TRE. I thank again each and every person who voted yes.

But you understand how I feel a bit personally on the line about the TRE. During the campaign, the biggest reservation I heard, even from supporters, was "If we approve this now and they don't need it in the future, will they roll it back?" At the time I thought surely so, but now I think not - or not without pressure.

Fast forward to September 2012. One year after the TRE, the new positions have been hired, the final property valuations are in, and administration is recommending a one time payment to the staff. Basically it is the balance of a 3% midpoint increase but paid as a lump sum rather than an add to base. So they know they can afford it and there is no future commitment.

The Board splits 4-3 in favor of the payment. Louise said it best - "We told staff and taxpayers this is why we needed the money. We have to keep our word." Jason and Mark were worried about fund balance and what the legislature might or might not do in 2013. Again, the recommendation was an affordable one time payment - not an add to base that would commit future revenues. Carl also voted against it. I could give him a new guy pass on that one but Jason and Mark should have known better.

Now it is summer of 2013 and the Board has been conservative in staff compensation in the spring because the legislature was in session and heaven only knows what they will do. As it happens, the legislature smiles and AISD receives more than anticipated. I think six million more is the number but not sure on that - let's say "several million." They have the opportunity to roll back a little of the M&O tax rate but they don't. I mean come on - at least take a page from the City of Allen book and lower it by 1/100th of a penny or something. Some good faith gesture even.

The deal is, once the district reduces the tax rate, they can't go back up again without holding another TRE. So they are afraid of their own voters. Instead, Jason suggests (and Mark supports) we lower the tax rate by gutting the general fund balance to pay for capital projects instead of selling authorized bonds. The First Southwest guys and Marlene have to go back and explain how bad it would be for the district to do that.

This is just 9 short months after they refused to spend 1 million out of fund balance to compensate staff!

Then, in October, Mark gets the idea to designate 2.5 million dollars out of the surplus for an add to base teacher raise. The Board never talked about the longer term implications of that add to base move. I even asked a couple of them if I missed it. Nope. Everybody votes for it (including Jason.)

It was most likely the right thing to do, but it was done in a vacuum of the right kind of information and inquiry. What I would have loved to have seen as a taxpayer (and would have asked for as a trustee last summer) is a cash flow projection for the next several years given best demographic projections, conservative property value increases, annual staff compensation increase, and do no harm from the legislature. What does that look like and what can we afford?

Instead here they are in January asking about spending $38K from an activity fund to resurface the tennis courts and extra bottled water for the kids during playoffs.

On the January 20 meeting that is the subject line of this post, Mark says that he will consider lowering the tax rate "if and only if the TRE rules change." Meaning if and only if they can reduce the rate now and raise it back later without calling another TRE.

Doesn't anyone see how wasteful and destructive this cycle is? The legislature gets beaten up because local tax rates went through the roof in the wake of the 2011 session. So they put money back into the system in 2013. But the local districts don't lower the rates at all because they don't trust the legislature not to take it away in the future and they don't trust their own voters to understand that and vote yes in the future. The legislators say - hey, we gave money back but the local boards did not do their part.

Jason and Mark SAY the taxpayers are their constituents (they don't say the kids are their constituents - that's another issue) but they clearly don't trust their constituents to understand complex issues and vote responsibly.

I personally believe the AISD should have lowered the M&O rate last summer. But then, I have profound respect and no fear with regard to my friends and neighbors who vote in Allen.

The Board has another chance this next summer. They have already said they'll be on the ballot in 2015 with a bond proposition for Lowery refresh and other maintenance items. Perfect time to revisit the TRE if the funding shrinks in the 2015 session. Allen voters are smart and responsible. The Board needs to show some faith.

I just feel the honest and concerned and intelligent dialog about the educaton and future of our children has been hijacked the past several years by special interests and empty political rhetoric. I want to see discussions about HB-5 with its changes in basic 4x4 curriculum and the graduate profile and a top to bottom refocus on the strategic plan.

Bringing in a new superintendent creates an opportunity for positive change. I hope we take it. The kids are our most important constituents. Let's not lose sight of that.




We have board members up for re-election so I have to ask how is our President of the school board
  • Quote:
pitch perfect

if you have a meeting (or two) with nothing getting done, needing to be wrapped up, and we're not getting some kind of a tax cut when you as my favorite past board member suggested we should?

I want them ALL out. We need change and it starts at the top. I hope we get good candidates with a passion and run against the current ones up for re-election.

There is too much indecisiveness, not enough innovative thinking, and people with their own agenda. I agree Allen children are first but Allen citizens all have a stake in this school distric and pay for it with their taxes.

  • Quote:
The Board has another chance this next summer. They have already said they'll be on the ballot in 2015 with a bond proposition for Lowery refresh and other maintenance items. Perfect time to revisit the TRE if the funding shrinks in the 2015 session. Allen voters are smart and responsible. The Board needs to show some faith.



Why don't we get some fresh faces on the board now? Second and third chances is not how I want my current school board operating.

James DeLaGarza
Realtor/Broker since 1992


 
vrs 
enthusiast
Posts: 2845
vrs
Loc: Allen, Texas
Reg: 04-20-00

02-18-14 07:51 PM - Post#166238    
    In response to Allensince1993

I think the election this year calls for a more nuanced approach from the voters than a blanket "throw the rascals out." Fortunately, I think the voters in Allen are sophisticated enough to sort it out.

Since you asked, I personally think Louise has done an awesome job this year holding things together with a board divided on some very fundamental issues and going through a superintendent search as well. A Board meeting is not a meeting staged for the public. It is a meeting of the Board held in front of the public. The Board itself must decide when a particular member is overstaying his welcome on the floor and may believe a greater good is served in the long run by letting a member run his course on a topic rather than cutting him off.

Look back to that meeting in September of 2012, which I cited in the earlier post. Louise was the first one up to make a motion and stand her position on keeping the TRE promises to the teachers and taxpayers. She has been a constant and effective advocate for the kids, the teachers, and the district. And when the Board announced its choice for superintendent, she was the one who struck the appropriate notes of strategic vision, graduate profile, academic direction.

Do I disagree with the Board on some decisions and decision processes? Yes, I do. But I have zero expectation that I will agree 100% of the time with people – even a person whom I think is doing a terrific job. And that is a good thing. One of my taglines reads “If everybody’s thinkin’ alike, that means somebody’s not thinkin.’” What I want to know is if I believe a trustee shares my overall values and perspectives and takes positions that are supportable based on that value system.

Louise has my absolute support in her bid for re-election. I feel very grateful that she is willing to sign on for three more years. If she does draw an opponent, I will be working very hard to help keep her in office and looking out for our kids for another term.


Raisin cookies that look like chocolate chip are the reason I have trust issues.


 
optimist 
member
Posts: 91

Reg: 08-13-11

02-18-14 08:20 PM - Post#166239    
    In response to vrs

I agree with vrs! Louise is a strong advocate for students, teachers and the community. I also appreciate the fact that she is willing to serve another term. She will definitely have my vote, regardless if she is opposed or not!

I would like to see vrs or someone with her leadership and logic run for the other board position. Any chance vrs?

 
Allensince1993 
enthusiast
Posts: 521

Reg: 06-06-12

02-18-14 11:35 PM - Post#166248    
    In response to optimist

This article is deeper than the bus barn. I encourage everyone to read it. It's about indecision and costing we the taxpayers more.

http://redappleproject.com/2012/04/allen-isd-ine ff...

You run a corporation like they run the school district and you deserve to be fired. They were in charge and they made expensive mistakes. I appreciate people's willingness to run but I want better CEO's at the top.

They also didn't make a wise decision, as was pointed out by a past board president, to give a tax cut after we received more than expected from the state immediately after passage of the TRE. Mismanagement and poor decision making is not in the best interest of the kids, teachers, and taxpayers.

This isn't a social contest or 'who I like best' contest. This is about change because leadership has failed us. We had stealing of the coffers under the last leadership, lack of filling critical positions (finance) at a time when budget and forecast is most critical, and lack of unity among the members.

From the article (link above):

Allen ISD receives the Red Apple Project Rotten Apple Award for inefficient spending and ignoring cost effective alternatives.

The Allen ISD Superintendent Contract Approved By Board 2012 – 2016 reveals that this superintendent earns more than the Governor of Texas, and look at the perks negotiated with the elected school board. Teachers tell us they spend their own money on classroom bulletin boards and other supplies.

Administrators salaries may surprise you. The Allen ISD Admin Compensation 11-12 shows many salaries double that of the average Allen ISD teacher’s salary of $50,227.

Using PEIMS— that is, the district’s own numbers— we found in the 2010 Snapshot from TEA, less than 50 cents of every education dollar makes it to the classroom.

The Allen ISD administration and Board of Trustees told parents and taxpayers that money was tight last year. The only way to counter th e funding shortage was to increase their taxes. Otherwise they would lay off teachers, pack more students into a classroom, delay a much needed elementary school, and reduce services for Students. However, nowhere do they cite the high superintendent and administrator salaries.



Another article (elementary) which gives an idea of how a President 'controls' a meeting because of their status and influence. http://vanessa-nestor.com/pdf_files/NewPolitics InA... Yes, I'm not happy with our current leadership.

  • Quote:
Fortunately, I think the voters in Allen are sophisticated enough to sort it out.



God, I wish I could agree with that statement. I LOVE Allen but voter turnout is horrible, no one ever shows up or complains unless there is a school boundary change or something affecting only their neighborhood, and we voted in a single-item candidate (bus barn) last election.
James DeLaGarza
Realtor/Broker since 1992


 
vrs 
enthusiast
Posts: 2845
vrs
Loc: Allen, Texas
Reg: 04-20-00

02-19-14 02:06 AM - Post#166249    
    In response to Allensince1993

All data requires context and the Rotten Apple people deserve a Rotten Tomato award for comparing apples and oranges - presenting data out of context for the purpose of advancing an agenda rather than informing accurately.

To get to the fewer than 50% of dollars going into the classroom number, they count debt service as well as M&O. With a combined rate of $1.67 and 50 cents of that on debt service I am not sure how any rational person would expect to get the number of dollars into the classroom above 50%.

Competitive salaries for teachers and total operations dollars per student are far more useful and even handed measures of district efficiency.

Let's have thoughtful conversations in this election cycle and be the voters we want everyone to be :-)
Raisin cookies that look like chocolate chip are the reason I have trust issues.


 
Allensince1993 
enthusiast
Posts: 521

Reg: 06-06-12

02-19-14 10:21 AM - Post#166256    
    In response to vrs

  • vrs Said:
All data requires context and the Rotten Apple people deserve a Rotten Tomato award for comparing apples and oranges - presenting data out of context for the purpose of advancing an agenda rather than informing accurately.

To get to the fewer than 50% of dollars going into the classroom number, they count debt service as well as M&O. With a combined rate of $1.67 and 50 cents of that on debt service I am not sure how any rational person would expect to get the number of dollars into the classroom above 50%.

Competitive salaries for teachers and total operations dollars per student are far more useful and even handed measures of district efficiency.

Let's have thoughtful conversations in this election cycle and be the voters we want everyone to be :-)



Sometimes change is good. I like Sam Johnson, a great wartime hero who survived that prison, but everyone says, "We want change, vote for a new congress!" yet they forget it starts locally. I don't want Sam Johnson because he's been there forever and he's had ample opportunity to be part of the change but he's not. He's part of the problem. If you want change in congress because of their deep ineptness then you vote locally to get them out. But no, we have low voter turnout and we all 'like our guy!'

The problem with the school board is they have been asleep at the wheel and let important positions go unfilled, had no accountability for the person who stole from under the nose of the school district, and have mismanaged funds. We voted for TRE then we got an overage from the state. Some want to take from the funds which could affect bond rating, some want to use for raises unsupported with long-term and unknown complications, and some wanted to give a sugar fix (one-time) of bonuses, etc. without considering the idea of a tax cut.

I want fresh faces, new ideas, innovative thinking. I don't think we need a person 'on top' of school financing and budget. I just want someone who's willing to say, "No, Mr. Helvey, we picked our spot for the barn and despite a petition with 700 signatures, why would we want to spend almost double to triple to relocate such a big 'idea' and risk upsetting even a lot more people!? Why would we spend more money elsewhere after we just spent millions in studies and land acquisition for that original location?" I don't want a rubberstamp board who goes with every single idea the superintendent advises.

Regarding the Red Apple Site:

http://redappleproject.com/find-your-isd/

This part of the site (link above) pulls data directly from TEA.

The average Admin. salary (superintendent and support) was $92,490 for Plano and their average teacher salary is $51,500 (2012). Frisco was $99,612 and $49,459 respectively. Allen was $129,267 and $50,720 respectively.

You mentioned how much gets into the room per student? TEA's site shows Plano puts 64% of every dollar towards the pupil. 60% in Frisco. 62% in Katy Texas. At 50%, at the time of the rotten apple award, I'd say "yes", Allen was well deserving of the award. The award came with low allocation of funds per student, high debt allocation towards projects, and because of a board who said yes to multi-million dollar project but then changed their minds because of a small outcry, some of which was from an adjoining city.

You've mentioned we do so much more with so much less than other districts but apparently TEA and it's facts and figures prove otherwise. We spend more for a superintendent where apparently 43 applications speaks volumes; it's a sought-after position which gives us leverage when negotiating salary. The guy was good for a few years but like most complacency can set in and people can rob the district blind from underneath your nose and you can get swayed by public opinion and cost the district millions.

  • Quote:
Competitive salaries for teachers and total operations dollars per student are far more useful and even handed measures of district efficiency.



I respectfully disagree. I think 'total instructional dollars per student' (itemized on TEA's website, also on link above) is a better indicator, not 'total operation dollars per student'.

Total for instructional dollars per student is as follows (2012):

Allen: $4,685
McKinney: $5,040
Frisco: $4,921
Plano $5,447

Debt does matter. M&O matters. We spend the highest in the area for leadership. We have the highest admin costs.

Using 'total operational dollars per student' is not a good figure because you're taking out the equation of debt and debt matters.

That's like me telling my kids, "hey, we have the same dollars coming in but we're going to buy a larger house and install a gorgeous swimming pool. Because we're going to do such we're going to have less dollars for you so let's cut back on soccer and ballet.

We have a great school district and we can trim some of the fat and get more dollars into 'instruction per student'. What happened in our 10/11 budget? We had stimulus money and "we put it into teacher salaries and we knew we couldn't sustain." -Ken Helvey Then we reduced the following year in our budget 44 teachers and 40 staff positions. Then TRE kicked in and then we got more than anticipated in a later budget but yet no mention of a tax cut, none.

I vote for change and I hope people with real passion will step up.
James DeLaGarza
Realtor/Broker since 1992


 
SB 
enthusiast
Posts: 1551

Reg: 09-07-03

02-19-14 01:13 PM - Post#166265    
    In response to Allensince1993

"The problem with the school board is they have been asleep at the wheel and let important positions go unfilled, had no accountability for the person who stole from under the nose of the school district, and have mismanaged funds"

Isn't it the Superintendent' s role to hire administrative staff and not the role of the Board - beyond hiring the Superintendent? I expect the new Superintendent will be busy filling critical positions.

Isn't the former employee already being prosecuted for theft? Isn't that accountability?

 
Allensince1993 
enthusiast
Posts: 521

Reg: 06-06-12

02-19-14 01:55 PM - Post#166268    
    In response to SB

  • SB Said:
"The problem with the school board is they have been asleep at the wheel and let important positions go unfilled, had no accountability for the person who stole from under the nose of the school district, and have mismanaged funds"

Isn't it the Superintendent' s role to hire administrative staff and not the role of the Board - beyond hiring the Superintendent? I expect the new Superintendent will be busy filling critical positions.

Isn't the former employee already being prosecuted for theft? Isn't that accountability?



The board made the decision to put off hiring until the new superintendent was hired thus giving him/her that opportunity. We had people in interim positions.

Did you have a comment towards me or VRS? She said:
  • Quote:
40 minutes in, Jason and a couple of the other trustees are surprised to discover there is only one employee in the finance department since Mark Tarpley left and the CFO position was left vacant to be filled by the new sup. I am a civilian and I knew that. I knew it last summer. When it was stated in a board workshop. Anyway, the entire exchange is kind of humorous in a very sad way.



I call that 'asleep at the wheel'. The board doesn't know who's where or what's missing? FYI, VRS was referencing a 2012 meeting. Marlene Harbeson was hired last September. Helvey announced his retirement last July effective in September.

Let's discuss accountability. Did we get the superintendent involved, get facts and details or did we let him ride away quietly into retirement? What were his thoughts on the exit interview? What could have been done differently? We never got any answers because the board was too busy praising all that he had accomplished. I'm taxpayer, you're a taxpayer. Don't you want to know how this happened, why it went on so long and how we can prevent it in the future? He hired a 'risk manager', something other ISD's have so if he was so forward-thinking and teaches school finance at a local college wouldn't he have known to do this years prior? This loss of money could have been prevented.

This finance director was stealing over a period of six years!!! All under the watch of Helvey. http://starlocalmedia.com/allenamerican/former- all...

"We can all look at the stadium as an iconic picture and it does not scream that we are a fiscally conservative district" -Ken Helvey

One statement I do agree with that Ken Helvey made was as follows, "Of course we do more with less! We have ONE High School and it's easier to manage more kids in one building....the school nurse is overloaded with an extra 400 kids than normal...but yes it's easier with them all in one building."
James DeLaGarza
Realtor/Broker since 1992


 
Will 
enthusiast
Posts: 254

Reg: 07-28-09

02-20-14 12:07 PM - Post#166296    
    In response to Allensince1993

I think that the Red Apple Project would be better served if they weren't slanting their read on numbers the way that you get out of MSNBC or Fox News. As a percentage of total budget, the superintendent's salary is not that significant - even the Stop The Barn crowd pointed out that $140,000 is .08% of the budget. Also comparing it to the governor's salary is a bit off given the other perquisites of the governor's office, not to mention other sources of income.

I see where both James and VRS are coming from. We do need to tighten things up - it's like we are a mom and pop shop that wakes up and sees that it has become a big company but still does things the "old" way. Just like the teachers do with our students, we need to keep pushing leadership to do even better.

 
SB 
enthusiast
Posts: 1551

Reg: 09-07-03

02-20-14 03:14 PM - Post#166300    
    In response to Will

The Red Apple Project is a part of Americans for Prosperity which is funded by the Koch Brothers. Any information they put out should be examined very critically because their agenda may seem to benefit the ordinary citizen but in reality it is usually to the ordinary citizen's detriment and the benefit is accrued to folks like the Koch's.

 
eddie 
member
Posts: 47

Reg: 08-30-11

03-03-14 12:16 AM - Post#166570    
    In response to SB

I know the Koch Brothers are Satan and all and any information they put out should be dismissed. In all fairness, though, can we include others in the dismissal?

http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php

The Koch's rank at 59 and the most evil corporation based on GOP donations is UPS at 17. Yet, they deliver.

Here's what is strange, though. I watch PBS a lot and those stupid Koch guys keep showing up as major sponsors. I guess they really hate education.

Regardless, the major money, one through 16 all donate to the Democrats. Maybe we should examine the information put out by them.

What is that word that the kids say today? Oh yeah. Whatever.

 
SB 
enthusiast
Posts: 1551

Reg: 09-07-03

03-03-14 04:12 AM - Post#166573    
    In response to eddie

Did I write "dismissed"? Whatever. I would critically examine anything coming from Americans for Prosperity because they have a history of releasing distorted information.

I'm sure there are left leaning organizations that put out distorted information too. In the context of this discussion, Americans for Prosperity was relevant to single out because educational excellence evaluations by their group was cited.


 
eddie 
member
Posts: 47

Reg: 08-30-11

03-04-14 12:57 AM - Post#166601    
    In response to SB

I'm with you. I don't have a dog in the hunt. If you want to critically review, critically review.

 
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